The issue i'm seeing is, that they're doing the same roles as the Starling.
Names and classes should to be secondary unique niches for the units.
Then we need a destroyer that is not ASW focused like HMS Starling. Been skimming online of different ships and their history. I've come across online about how the Royal Navy was excellent at night fighting but I don't think there is any boat with night fighting abilities. Unless HMS Barfleur with Improved Radar is one of them. If HMS Barfleur is one of them, an early war one would be good idea since Barfleur has '44 date.
Some of the Royal Navy destroyers went under AA conversion. Could AA Barrage or AA Specialist be enough to added on one of them?
And Flak, speaking of Canadian commanders...J.D. "Chummy" Prentice (1899-1979). Sank the most u boats with 4 confirmed kills.
Erwin Rommel - "Give me American supply lines, British planes, German officers and Canadian troops, and I can take over the world".
I'm not sure where to go with the Canadian choice either. A small ship choice is overdue but with NZ getting Arbutus and the RN Starling, could end up flooded a bit. Huron is a solid choice for a DD but they have good DD numbers already. Could a commander or possibly an aircraft choice free up that slot from the UK options?
Not sure on Bishopdale, seems like an Ohio all over again. Cant see why we're pushing for these standard Auxiliaries when other unique/niche choices are still undone. QM & Ohio I can see because of their fame but M Star types at this stage instead of tenders (Maidstone), Aux AA ships (PAL/POZ), CAM (E McAlpine), Repair etc? I still think the Netherlands are one slot heavy for this reason with the Amsterdam. That L class sub for the Russians would be better for example. Would have been against Normandie for the French for the same reason.
Re: Niche and solid repeat sister units for sure but there is going to be crossovers to some extent at this stage. It's OK trying to get niche abilities in where possible but I'm not a fan of then getting more remote units over better known stuff. The RN destroyer leaders are an example where it just happens several are standout. Even if they get either DD or Flotilla leader the other differing SA abilities should then be enough to give them individual identity. We have Faulknor already but still without the other great MED leader in Jervis. Keppel for an older DD just happens to be the standout leader and ship of its vintage. Onslow is the best representative of the O class because of that one engagement etc. but again a DD leader.
"That's right son, join the navy. Get behind a bloody big gun and knock the hell out of somebody"
"We went out, got our arses kicked, then came back again"
Like the Lily/sally for the Japanese, overdue. If they add a DD and light cruiser that would then depend on dropping the aircraft down to two for an auxiliary. The axis slots are looking more settled at the mo.
Sub for the UK...I will stand on that hill! lol
"That's right son, join the navy. Get behind a bloody big gun and knock the hell out of somebody"
"We went out, got our arses kicked, then came back again"
I'm not sure where to go with the Canadian choice either. A small ship choice is overdue but with NZ getting Arbutus and the RN Starling, could end up flooded a bit. Huron is a solid choice for a DD but they have good DD numbers already. Could a commander or possibly an aircraft choice free up that slot from the UK options?
I was looking last night at the escort type ships we have. A Tribal Class could be repeated but just doesn't seem right. As you said, could bring in a Flower Class corvette or River Class frigate but that is flooding the deck with to many small ships. I think all the Canadian destroyers currently in-game have some kind of convoy or ASW abilities. Need something different if another destroyer, frigate or corvette will be introduced.
Last Edit: Sept 16, 2023 3:18:17 GMT by TrickiVic: Added Canadian
Erwin Rommel - "Give me American supply lines, British planes, German officers and Canadian troops, and I can take over the world".
Bishopdale is not in the mix. Just a cool thing i came across. I think any more commanders will bloat it.
Auxiliaries are just that, i'd rather a destroyer radar picket than a slow defenceless tub doing the same thing. Units need to work in a race to middle sense as well as having a distinct role. Obscure aux's do the former very poorly.
Niches are critical to functional development. Starling v the ww1 destroyer in this thread a golden example. Both ships will be 6-7points with a ASW sa and token convoy SA, but we've already got swale and electra doing the same thing, plus some other slightly different 6-7points that aren't as specialised but probably more useful general. So while a single, or even pair of for the collectors picks can pass muster. It not a design priority in the game sense.
Swiftsure was close last deck and I would edge that over Adventure for choice. The two IJN carriers seems more attractive if you drop an aircraft. Otherwise, big ship/aircraft heavy and leaving a DD, LC, or now unlikely Aux fighting for one slot.
Re: Normandie above, I meant the liner if it had ever been picked.
"That's right son, join the navy. Get behind a bloody big gun and knock the hell out of somebody"
"We went out, got our arses kicked, then came back again"
I'm not sure where to go with the Canadian choice either. A small ship choice is overdue but with NZ getting Arbutus and the RN Starling, could end up flooded a bit. Huron is a solid choice for a DD but they have good DD numbers already. Could a commander or possibly an aircraft choice free up that slot from the UK options?
I was looking last night at the escort type ships we have. A Tribal Class could be repeated but just doesn't seem right. As you said, could bring in a Flower Class corvette or River Class frigate but that is flooding the deck with to many small ships. I think all the destroyers currently in-game have some kind of convoy or ASW abilities. Need something different if another destroyer, frigate or corvette will be introduced.
Destroyer swarms are just a bit boring for repeated use. Ive always looked at unit selection with a view to a viable 100point thematic fleet. Adding more dds adds SA options but not archetypes. Liie for the RAN, HMCS Warrior would anchor a alternate fleet design. Puncher would be a cruiser equivalent if Warrior irks people.
Yeah, trying to keep that niche/collector balance is key for both camps.
Regarding the auxiliaries, the better the fleet support the unit offers, has always seen it used more use in my experience. Boost speed, torps role etc. But for example an Aux like an AA ship is more like a standard non aux type but obviously is and is covering both bases. Palomares VS Dido etc.
I just keep envisioning all these obscure or never been built big ships we will end up with at the day of reckoning but gaps regarding the unusual historical units that actually did sterling service.
"That's right son, join the navy. Get behind a bloody big gun and knock the hell out of somebody"
"We went out, got our arses kicked, then came back again"
Swiftsure was close last deck and I would edge that over Adventure for choice. The two IJN carriers seems more attractive if you drop an aircraft. Otherwise, big ship/aircraft heavy and leaving a DD, LC, or now unlikely Aux fighting for one slot.
Re: Normandie above, I meant the liner if it had ever been picked.
I don't think swiftsure and adventure are competeing for slots. Ones minelayer>tender, the others a latewar radar cruiser.
Yeah, its a question of what AC to drop. Carriers outnumber aircraft cards, so the jean is hard to go past, but the kate will be the preferred pick almost always. A naval air service fighter is nice, but again, zero is a more likely pick. Light bombers can be interesting but are well provided at this point.
Nations arent competing subs for big ticket ships though. The dutch are due a significant sized ship, they have limited options in that respect. A liner with war service is in my mind desirable than a napkin design sister. And dds and small cruisers are non starters.
Oscure is a bit of red herring though. Often a ship that is notable, ie name recognition, is because of a freak incident. Its actual war service is mundane as its sisters.
Battlestars an awful way to pick ships too. The ships that accumulate them are often on the periphery. Shifts with fewer stars have gotten into scraps and need repair, missing the next action.
Just coming back to this thread cause I am looking at Deck H. Adding three cruisers that have nothing yet
Tatsuta - Tenryu Class no card
Sakawa - Agano Class no card
Kashima - Katori Class no card
Flak Says, other than filling out a class (assuming all decks are being discussed together) the last 2 didn't do anything meaningfully useful in the games format?
I meant just in terms of potentially preferring that cruiser if we only have one and if we are sticking to the two aircraft, two big ships again. If the UK doesn't get an auxiliary again, then to try and get a sub in. Another deck without a sub (after 1 wizards and 1 team deck without) and everybody else getting one puts their choices further behind. That to me is the second must/need/request after Starling.
An Amagi would have the benefit of an Akagi mini available.
"That's right son, join the navy. Get behind a bloody big gun and knock the hell out of somebody"
"We went out, got our arses kicked, then came back again"