Land Fighter-Bomber - This unit can't be based on a Carrier, and it can't benefit from the Expert Dogfighter or Expert Dive Bomber bonuses
Fighter-Bomber - When you place this unit during the Air Mission phase, declare whether this unit's type will be Fighter or Dive Bomber this turn. It can make Bomb attacks only while it's a Dive Bomber. While a Dive Bomber, reduce its Armor and Vital Armor each by 1.
AA 7 one role, air defense Bomb 9 one role, bombing carriers and cruisers Escort one role, increasing armor on bombers
You want this to do 3 things and be costed accordingly, weeds wants this to do 2 things and be costed accordingly. Everyone who wants this to do 1 thing or 2 things is going to vote against you.
Land Fighter-Bomber - This unit can't be based on a Carrier, and it can't benefit from the Expert Dogfighter or Expert Dive Bomber bonuses
Fighter-Bomber - When you place this unit during the Air Mission phase, declare whether this unit's type will be Fighter or Dive Bomber this turn. It can make Bomb attacks only while it's a Dive Bomber. While a Dive Bomber, reduce its Armor and Vital Armor each by 1.
The reality of this is that it's going to be a bomber that can shoot sometimes. Even with Escort, it will only ever be used as a bomber or something to defend your ships. Escort planes are cheap and plentiful and so if you'd be using this as an escort, things have gone horribly wrong.
To you from failing hands we throw the torch be yours to hold it high. -In Flanders Fields. John McCrea
We have been doing some work in the Dev thread that has highlighted to me that this aircraft should not be a bomb 9. The P-38 was not optimized to be a bomber, and a bomb 9 score on a fighter in 1942 is power creep in this game. I think we should back it down to bomb 8.
First, a reminder that this should be a bomb 8, not 9.
Second,
I picked the Fw 190 simply because it was the closest unit in the game in concept to this one that I could find.
The P-38G was developed as an Escort/Interceptor. I wish it was 8 points, but it isn't unless you house rule it (highly recommended if you can agree on that with your opponents).
The P-38F description in the notes I provided at the beginning...
"P-38F - entered service February, 1942. First to be able to carry external drop tanks, 1,000 lb bombs, 22 in torpedoes, or smoke producing apparatus. First large-scale use in North Africa. Excellent at intercepting cargo and transport aircraft, but found to be lacking as fighters."
This is the only really significant variant prior to the G. I don't think the idea was to just to a "fixed P-38G." I thought the idea was to do an earlier variant and make it a fighter-bomber. As others have said and I still also agree, giving a strong fighter-bomber the Escort ability is counter-productive and power creep. The US already has the ideal land-based Escort with the P-40. Probably the best land-based fighter in the game cost/power wise. The P-38F (if that is what we are doing and maybe we should decide that first!) doesn't need Escort or the additional cost it would entail IMO.
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I will say as an aside that I think Interceptor is a little underrated. It has the effect of forcing most players to expend some points on a fighter or two for their fleet build, and I think that is significant if nothing else. It makes the risk of using a full four-bomber attack group even greater.
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That’s certainly more beneficial for a navy that doesn’t have ready access to 9 vital escorts.
I've seen your poll interesting.
My thoughts on this unit are based on an 8 vital and 8 bomb value;; To me a more accurate proposal.
As for your polling, what ever todays interested parties vote the consensus though the years, was it should have been 8.
Using that and comparing units for cost as best we can, the P-38G I will agree is in that 8.5 range, and the P-38F is in the 9.5 range, as are so many air units.
Comparing with other comparable units not just the 190, look at the DAP Beaufighter and Hurricane MXII your not far off.
What would the Firefly FMK1 cost without the every Carrier turn plus.
I'm not changing any minds here, but don't tell me this unit at 9 pts with Escort is over cost especially with whats been done in the past by Expansion Teams.
I just look to give a new unit its best chance for table time, something its Navy doesn't have, its not replacing an original, and doesn't upend the game.
I think the 190a3 and Stuka 87E at 11 is a worst fit than this at 9.