So I think the current proposal is this. I think it would be pretty good unit and unique as well for a DD.
USS SOMERS Class: Somers Commissioned: Dec 1937 Fate: Broken Up 1947 Displacement: 2047 tons standard Length(OA): 381 ft Beam: 36 ft Speed: 37 kts Armament: 8-5in/38 (4 x 2) 8-1.1 in (2 x 4) 2-0.5 in, 12-21 in (3 x 4) TT ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Code Intercepts - At the end of the second player's Sea Movement step, you may place this unit in an adjacent sector that contains an enemy Auxiliary. Light Ship Tactics - Once per game, at the beginning of the Surface attack phase, you can declare you're using Light Ship Tactics. If you do, whenever an enemy Ship makes an attack against this unit this turn, roll a die. On a 5 or higher, this unit takes no damage from that attack. Defective Torpedoes 1 - Whenever this unit would make a Torpedo attack, roll a die. On a 1, the attack automatically misses instead.
Got to admit guys, with Defective Torps, I wouldn't ever use this. 1941. USS Wainwright DD419. Despite the weaker mains and vital armor, a flat out better DD at the same cost. Defective torps is a total pain in the ass that I avoid like the plague.
I thought Wainwright was 10 pts. Hmm. It is hard to cost US DDs with Fletcher as a baseline. On the other hand, we have Phelps at 10.
So, 9 points without DT1, or 8 points with? Which do you prefer? I lean toward with DF1. DF1 doesn't scare me off that much. Especially at 8 points! But I would be fine with either.
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Although others can't see it, we already gave Buchanan a mild negative SA. I don't think we should do that with both US DDs. One or the other would need to go IMO.
Historically they both fit, but that is pretty hard core for one deck.
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There are so many good USN DDs available that any new ones with a negative SA are likely to get ignored unless they also come with some kind of unique benefit. This ship has some brawny stats, but it is going to constantly compete for "table space" against other DDs in the same cost range with capabilities like Smoke, Sub Hunter, Close Escort. I think its got a chance to see play at 9 points with no defective torps. With defective torps, I really doubt it would get used much, even at 8 points. I've tried Bagley and Gudgeon....I no longer use them. Ever.
Given Gwin got shafted. Buchanan should not have been
That's a fair point. Especially given Gwin was less than exciting.
I am not sure where to take this. Of the two I would say the DT on this one is more palatable than Buchanan, and more consistent with the range 2 x 2 torps. I would be okay with revisiting Buchanan too.
It comes down to risk aversion versus benefit. I know the lot of players won't use a unit with a negative SA regardless of benefit. However, I know some players that enjoy the risk as long as there is a good benefit in return.
But having a negative SA on both is too much for sure.
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I think Code Intercepts is very appropriate and relevant to the German blockade running merchant ships she captured. And it is an SA I would like to personally see on more Allied ships to counter the very broken and multiplying number of German raiders with cloaking devices. This is one of the few SAs that are effective against those ships.
Light Ship Tactics seems close enough to me to represent her French coast engagements.
I am fine with not doing the negative SA. I think those of you that don't like it are overestimating its impact overall. Especially for a range 2 attack from a US ship. I think it is definitely 9 points without the DT SA. Personally, I would be more likely to use it at 8 point with the SA. But that is just me.
8 points without the DT SA is too low IMO. Especially compared to Phelps. Wainwright, Fletcher, and Johnston are top of the bin and can't be reasonably be outdone. So we are looking at DDs that fill specific niches IMO.
So is 9 points without the SA where we are landing?
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