I'm not looking at game stats, I'm talking about the real things. You are entitled to think that a small capacity, 22k ton carrier has it's advantages. It does. However, I'd rather be aboard the one you dis instead. Again, a Lex whoops an Ark Royal in game and real life anytime. Airwing and doctrine are what you have when you go fight.
The question did not ask "Best design", did it?
You can go into a battle with Lexington; I'm going into a World War with the Ark Royal Design. Don't care what the question was, he put up a list and i'd go with Yorktown, Shokaku or Ark Royal before the Lexington. Airwing and Doctrine don't make for a good carrier, how to win a war does. In the real world the Lexington class really do all that well;; did it. All their torpedo protection didn't save them or keep them our of dry dock when it was really needed. They were not fuel or cost effective; they couldn't maneuver they way out of trouble [helm response time was terrible] they had a narrow approach deck and their Combat Command Center was small; etc. Big, Clumsy, Poor Design; they were just leftovers. Ark Royal was innovative; First carrier to have a flight deck and hanger, integrated with the hull; The future of smart carrier design more with less. For treaty limitations the Ark Royal was pretty tough especially for the Atlantic theater where needs were a lot different than the Pacific.
In a Lexington vs Ark Royal battle, the results for the categories are the following (according to "Jacky" Fisher's Criteria:
1. Air Wing:
Ark Royal - 72 design, 50-60 in practice
Lexington - 78
Winner: Lexington
2. AA Defense:
Ark Royal - 16, 4.5 dual purpose guns. 32, 2 pounder (40 mm) AA. 32, 0.5 inch AA
Lexington - 8, 8 inch guns. 12, 5 inch dual purpose guns (more AA added later, not listed on Wikipedia Article)
Winner: Ark Royal
3. Damage Control:
Ark Royal - Mediocre
Lexington - Good
Winner: Lexington
4. Survivability:
Ark Royal - Good (strong hull, but still a treaty carrier)
Lexington - Excellent (A result of battlecruiser lineage)
Winner: Lexington
5. Speed and Range
Ark Royal - 31 knot top speed, operational range of 7,600 Nautical Miles at 20 knots
Lexington - 33.25 knot top speed, operational range of 10,000 nautical miles at 10 knots
Winner: Lexington
Overall Winner: Lexington, by a score of 4-1.
I think that is pretty conclusive right there.
Some points i think your a little basis on; 1; Air Wing larger yes; but until later in the war the USN couldn't coordinate an attack with its principle aircraft type DB TB Fighter; mainly do to cruising speed and range case in point Midway; also the Lead Dauntless provided the dual roll of Attack command and attacking itself; again at Midway two wings were going to attack one carrier until several pilots realized the mistake and attack the second; VERY LUCKY. 2; Ark royal 3; I would always give to USN but both carriers did a poor job there. 4; Survivability; Ark Royal lasted a lot long in war time than Lexington and just because the Hull had added protection does nothing against Dive Bombers; Lex took its lumps there and SARA didn't do all that well staying out of dry dock against Torpedos; Ark Royal had a tough deck. 5; Speed; Doesn't really mean to much when you can't maneuver your ship, especially in battle, Lex class had a terrible helm response time. Also did you notice the range at KNOTS; I think today you would call the Lexington a gas guzzler.
Looking at WAS cards these things to me can only be properly represented in cost and thats really beyond what the game is, some are done well some not. So game wise i can see most wanting to go to battle with the LEX Class, than i could see Yorktown/ Shokaku. Most UK carrier's don't have Expert Bomber because the UK really didn't have a true one; so they are at a bit of a disadvantage in these cases; doesn't mean they wren't excellent carriers.
The bulk of 1941? When claude, buffaloes and devestators were front line aircraft?
I'm pretty sure that most Japanese carriers carried the Zero and that the Buffalo had been relegated to secondary roles, like defending Midway island.
Formerly "Admiral Jacky Fisher."
"It follows then as certain as that night succeeds the day, that without a decisive naval force we can do nothing definitive, and with it, everything honorable and glorious"--George Washington
The bulk of 1941? When claude, buffaloes and devestators were front line aircraft?
I'm pretty sure that most Japanese carriers carried the Zero and that the Buffalo had been relegated to secondary roles, like defending Midway island.
I may have the Buffalo date wrong though.
Formerly "Admiral Jacky Fisher."
"It follows then as certain as that night succeeds the day, that without a decisive naval force we can do nothing definitive, and with it, everything honorable and glorious"--George Washington
The bulk of 1941? When claude, buffaloes and devestators were front line aircraft?
Upon further research it seems that Lexington's air group still had Buffalos in December 1941 but that the Enterprise, a Yorktown class, was using Wildcats.
Formerly "Admiral Jacky Fisher."
"It follows then as certain as that night succeeds the day, that without a decisive naval force we can do nothing definitive, and with it, everything honorable and glorious"--George Washington
Still, I think 1941 US aircraft (wildcat, even the Devastator) are superior to the outdated Swotdfish and Sea Hurricane/Fulmer Fighters
And the Japanese aircraft, of course. The zero was hands down superior to other carrier fighters of 1941 and the Kate and Vals were very formidable as well.
"It follows then as certain as that night succeeds the day, that without a decisive naval force we can do nothing definitive, and with it, everything honorable and glorious"--George Washington
United States Navy Aircraft Carriers December 07, 1941
by Jack McKillop
On 7 December 1941, the U.S. Navy had seven aircraft carriers (CVs) and one aircraft escort vessel (AVG) in commission. The CVs were considered warships and the AVG was considered an auxiliary vessel. In addition to these eight ships, the keels of five other CVs had been laid. The names, history, status and aviation units of each of these ships is described below.
USS LEXINGTON (CV-2)
The keel of this ship was laid down at the Fore River Shipbuilding Co., Quincy, Massachusetts on 8 Jan 21 as Constitution, Battle Cruiser, First Line Number 1 (CC-1). Because of the limitations defined in the Washington Naval Treaty signed in 1922, she was authorized to be completed as an aircraft carrier on 1 Jul 22 and was renamed Lexington. The Lexington was launched on 3 Oct 25 and commissioned 14 Dec 27.
On 7 Dec 41, the Lexington Air Group was composed of:
Bombing Squadron Two (VB-2) with 15 Douglas SBD-2 Dauntless Fighting Squadron Two (VF-2) with 16 Brewster F2A-3 Buffalos Scouting Squadron Two (VS-2) with 1 Douglas SBD-2 and 14 SBD-3 Dauntless Torpedo Squadron Two (VT-2) with 12 Douglas TBD-1 Devastators
In order to augment the air defenses for Midway Island, USS Lexington departed Pearl Harbor on 5 Dec with 18 Vought SB2U-3 Vindicators of Marine Scouting Bombing Squadron Two Thirty One (VMSB-231) aboard. Along with the heavy cruisers USS Chicago (CA-29), USS Portland (CA-33) and USS Astoria (CA-34) and five destroyers, the Lexington formed Task Force 12.
The plan was to approach within 400 miles (640 km) of Midway and fly the Marine squadron off to land on the island; Lexington would then be free to continue training/scouting. This position would have been reached by mid-morning of 7 Dec. Upon learning of the Japanese attack on Pearl Harbor, the Lexington launched search planes to hunt for the Japanese fleet, and at midmorning headed south to rendezvous with USS Indianapolis (CA-35) and USS Enterprise (CV-6) task forces to conduct a search SOUTHWEST of Oahu until returning to Pearl Harbor on 13 December.
USS Lexington was sunk by aerial bombs and torpedoes during the Battle of the Coral Sea, 8 May 42. Her name was struck from the Naval Register on 24 June 42.
USS SARATOGA (CV-3)
The Saratoga was a sister ship of the Lexington and her keel was originally laid down as a Battle Cruiser, First Line Number 3 (CC-3) on 25 Sep 20 at the New York Shipbuilding Corp., Camden, New Jersey. She was ordered converted to an aircraft carrier and reclassified CV-3 on 1 Jul 22. Saratoga was launched on 7 Apr 25 and commissioned on 16 Nov 27.
On 7 Dec 41, USS Saratoga was just entering San Diego after an interim dry docking at Bremerton, Washington. The Saratoga Air Group consisted of:
Bombing Squadron Three (VB-3) with 21 Douglas SBD-3 Dauntless Fighting Squadron Three (VF-3) with 7 Grumman F4F-3 and 2 F4F-3A Wildcats Scouting Squadron Three (VS-3) with 22 Douglas SBD-3 Dauntless Torpedo Squadron Three (VT-3) with 12 Douglas TBD-1 Devastators
USS Saratoga survived World War II and was used as a test ship at the Bikini A-bomb tests in Jul 46. She sank in Bikini Atoll on 25 Jul 46 and her name was struck from the Naval Register on 15 Aug 46.
Still, I think 1941 US aircraft (wildcat, even the Devastator) are superior to the outdated Swotdfish and Sea Hurricane/Fulmer Fighters
Your quite right; different theaters different needs; Air groups being equal whats the better Carrier or Design Besides the Swordfish did pretty good against the Bismarck and at Taranto Italy; it would never stand up to Pacific needs, but it served the UK well enough
The Ark Royal was no doubt a good carrier, but the US has superior aircraft even by early war standards. Winston Churchill makes much note of this in his writings about the Fleet Air Arm and it's complex relationship with the RAF and the RN
The Ark Royal was no doubt a good carrier, but the US has superior aircraft even by early war standards. Winston Churchill makes much note of this in his writings about the Fleet Air Arm and it's complex relationship with the RAF and the RN
This is all true; but if some one ask whats the best carrier, does that mean Hypothetically if St LO has an F16 on it, its a better carrier than Yorktown?
Well not nessecarily, but remember all factors are being taken into account, including quality of aircraft as of 1941
the quality of the pilots is also extremely important. The pilots on Akagi and Kaga had been fighting for years in China and were very experienced--much more so than their foreign counterparts, including the USN. As the US military is keenly aware, there is no substitute for real combat experience.
Formerly "Admiral Jacky Fisher."
"It follows then as certain as that night succeeds the day, that without a decisive naval force we can do nothing definitive, and with it, everything honorable and glorious"--George Washington