Some people have a desire to provide quality, and some just want profit. My son told me one of the oldest pieces of writing is from Sumaria. It is a note from a craftsman to the "mayor" (or similar authority) complaining about the poor quality of the copper that someone sold him.
We never change.
The IJN Carrier Liberation Force - "Because We Care" Join the IJNCVLF. Service Guarantees Citizenship!
In ancient Sumer the mayor and physician and priest were the same.
I’m constantly disappointed in the level of just-get-by quality in the everyday world. Within three days of moving in the last house that we bought I found two plumbing issues that the inspector should have caught, and I’m not trained at all in that field. We just got a “new to us” microwave from the ‘90s and I wondered aloud how many new microwaves that one has outlasted.
I’m interested in this game but I’m not even really playing War at Sea right now, how does the gameplay compare with the old beer-and-peanuts herself?
1. It includes the stats for many of the ship classes for the USN, RN, IJN, Kriegsmarine, and Regina Marina.
So no French or Russians? That's a huge step backwards from the 1st edition.
With the original game they slowly released additional nations with pdf's from the old Mongoose web site.
Somehow I missed those. Any idea where they might exist now?
As I recall they were included as part of the Mongoose newsletters. I suggest checking that website to see if they are still available for download. That was back in the 2007/2010 era I think. Striker mentioned above that Warlord Games is working on add-ons for more navies.
The IJN Carrier Liberation Force - "Because We Care" Join the IJNCVLF. Service Guarantees Citizenship!
I’m interested in this game but I’m not even really playing War at Sea right now, how does the gameplay compare with the old beer-and-peanuts herself?
VaS is a more "traditional" tabletop game like Battletech. Open movement by inches, arcs of fire, damage rolls, etc. It is not nearly as complex as Battletech, but that is the basic idea.
The IJN Carrier Liberation Force - "Because We Care" Join the IJNCVLF. Service Guarantees Citizenship!
So no French or Russians? That's a huge step backwards from the 1st edition.
Somehow I missed those. Any idea where they might exist now?
As I recall they were included as part of the Mongoose newsletters. I suggest checking that website to see if they are still available for download. That was back in the 2007/2010 era I think. Striker mentioned above that Warlord Games is working on add-ons for more navies.
I looked through the back catalogue of Signs and Portents. I found a bunch of extra ships for existing fleets, but nothing about new navies. Oh well, I'm sure once I eventually get around to picking up the new hardback, creating new units should be easy enough.
As I recall they were included as part of the Mongoose newsletters. I suggest checking that website to see if they are still available for download. That was back in the 2007/2010 era I think. Striker mentioned above that Warlord Games is working on add-ons for more navies.
I looked through the back catalogue of Signs and Portents. I found a bunch of extra ships for existing fleets, but nothing about new navies. Oh well, I'm sure once I eventually get around to picking up the new hardback, creating new units should be easy enough.
In Warlords podcast they stated that they are working on the Russian fleet as we speak. US, UK, French, Japanese, German and Italians are already in the game.
I just added up everything you can buy for Victory at Sea from Warlord Games without duplicating models and it came out to $2,200.00. I probably missed or over counted one or two, but you get the idea. And you would still need to assemble and paint the minis!
I was just curious. I have the Starter and the full rulebook. I probably won't go any further.
The IJN Carrier Liberation Force - "Because We Care" Join the IJNCVLF. Service Guarantees Citizenship!
I just added up everything you can buy for Victory at Sea from Warlord Games without duplicating models and it came out to $2,200.00. I probably missed or over counted one or two, but you get the idea. And you would still need to assemble and paint the minis!
I was just curious. I have the Starter and the full rulebook. I probably won't go any further.
Yes, and duplicating models is a bigger thing with respect to aircraft in Warlord's Victory at Sea than in A&A War at Sea, because carrier based aircraft stands of 4 aircraft each in VaS actually represent the aircraft one-to-one. Not like in War at Sea where three flight stands of 3 aircraft fills the Yorktown, in VaS a Yorktown-class carrier is given 24 stands of 4 aircraft totaling 96 aircraft, according to the BattleScribe roster builder application:
The Dauntless dive bomber is not yet released by Warlord, so I used only what is currently available to fill the Yorktown with equal parts fighter, TB, and bomber. To get this loadout one needs to buy 2x US Navy Aircraft boxes, which contain 4x Avenger flights, 4x Wildcat flights, and a single Catalina stand. Also needed are two Corsair boxes which have 4x flights each, which is the standard number for a single airplane type box. Left over will be two Catalinas per Yorktown-class carrier.
So 2+2 aircraft boxes per Yorktown-class carrier. For other nations it gets trickier, as Warlord has mixed in carrier incompatible types such that one only gets one group of four flights out of their larger aircraft boxes, and separates are not yet available in several cases.
So for the Yorktown, going from one extreme with War at Sea one has 3x flight stands, while on other extreme with VaS v2 one has 24x flight stands! There have been negative comments on the VaS Facebook group with regards to aircraft traffic jams in carrier battles.
Possibly a sweet spot for a single aircraft stand would be 4x in scale aircraft representing a squadron of 12x aircraft. That way representing Yorktown with 96x aircraft would need only 8x stands of aircraft. Or perhaps a stand could represent 8x aircraft.
Post by admiralwoodside on Dec 27, 2021 9:46:47 GMT
mnnorthstars
I assume by squadron you are referring to the 2010 Rulebook page 12 definition:
"An Aircraft model represents a squadron of up to 25 aircraft."
The 12x aircraft sweet spot for a single aircraft stand that I was referring to is what I normally understand to be the typical "operational strength" of an RAF squadron (out of as many as 16 total aircraft), and approximately for other nations as well, but it varied somewhat during the war and by theater. Taking this value of 12 for a squadron as the minimum sized tactical unit that gets a miniatures model, we are therefore talking about the same raw number, but in game terminology it would be considered a half-squadron. Definitions aside, here is a potential modification of WaS to "WaS-half-squadrons" of approximately 12x AC:
AIRCRAFT CARRIED:
(Aircraft Capacities plus-6 or minus-5 AC. This gives bin slots of 12 AC centered around the slightly-offset Center value for the number of "half-squadrons" of 12.)
Compare the above "half-squadron" allocations with the currently accepted understanding of aircraft carried in A&A WaS from "Guidlines for WAS Stats" on this forum:
To determine the Aircraft Basing Capacity of an Aircraft Carrier unit in the game, divide the number of aircraft carried on the actual aircraft carrier by 25 (25 is the Wotc "standard" squadron size). Round up where appropriate (.5+).
The hard part of the mod (LOL) would be to work out the attack numbers and costs. Still, it would give a much more fine grained ability to classify the myriad types of aircraft carrying vessels in WaS.
I just added up everything you can buy for Victory at Sea from Warlord Games without duplicating models and it came out to $2,200.00. I probably missed or over counted one or two, but you get the idea. And you would still need to assemble and paint the minis!
I was just curious. I have the Starter and the full rulebook. I probably won't go any further.
And that's $US.
My plan is to get the Starter, 1 x fleet box of each nation and 1 mini of what doesn't come in the fleet box. Not interested in duplicates of the same class or the aircraft boxes because they don't come with cards. All I need ATM is the French box and the Surcouf. So far I've spent over $1000 AU. Not sure I want to continue with my collection.
I just added up everything you can buy for Victory at Sea from Warlord Games without duplicating models and it came out to $2,200.00. I probably missed or over counted one or two, but you get the idea. And you would still need to assemble and paint the minis!
I was just curious. I have the Starter and the full rulebook. I probably won't go any further.
And that's $US.
My plan is to get the Starter, 1 x fleet box of each nation and 1 mini of what doesn't come in the fleet box. Not interested in duplicates of the same class or the aircraft boxes because they don't come with cards. All I need ATM is the French box and the Surcouf. So far I've spent over $1000 AU. Not sure I want to continue with my collection.
What you are trying to purchase (plus the rulebook that I suspect you already have) is exactly what I priced out at $2,200.00 US. Oops, subtract the aircraft. I also included the submarine/PT boat packs.
Last Edit: Dec 28, 2021 22:21:19 GMT by weedsrock2
The IJN Carrier Liberation Force - "Because We Care" Join the IJNCVLF. Service Guarantees Citizenship!
My plan is to get the Starter, 1 x fleet box of each nation and 1 mini of what doesn't come in the fleet box. Not interested in duplicates of the same class or the aircraft boxes because they don't come with cards. All I need ATM is the French box and the Surcouf. So far I've spent over $1000 AU. Not sure I want to continue with my collection.
What you are trying to purchase (plus the rulebook that I suspect you already have) is exactly what I priced out at $2,200.00 US. Oops, subtract the aircraft. I also included the submarine/PT boat packs.
I have the following - Battle of the Pacific $125 US Fleet $200 USS Yorktown $45 USS Missouri $45 USS Idaho $37.50 US Subs & MTB’s $65 IJN Fleet $200 Akagi $45 Yamato $37.50 IJN Subs & MTB’s $65 UK Fleet $200 HMS Ark Royal $45 HMS Warspite $37.50 HMS Hood $45 UK Subs & MTB’ $65 KM Fleet $200 Bismarck $40 Admiral Graf Spee & Scheer $50 KM U-Boats & MTB’s $65 RM Fleet $200 Vittorio Veneto $40 RM Subs & MTB’s $65 Merchant Convo $125 Rulebook $99
Of course I had a discount on these prices.
I'm chasing the French Fleet box, Richeleiu and Surcouf but it looks like it will cost at least another $300. My local FGS hasn't had any new V@S stock in for awhile and none of the stock on the shelves is selling so I may have to go online which is something I don't normally do.
Not interested in duplicates with the same card so not interested int the Missouri, Tirpitz etc. I brought the Idaho thinking it was a different BB to the one in the fleet box, that was my first "wake-up" to how Warlords were going to market this.