Post by kingtiger1945 on Aug 22, 2018 16:30:39 GMT
In testing for the large scale battle scenario I posted about earlier (more updates coming for that in the future), my group has been playing with a bunch of torpedo houserules to make things interesting. However we'd like some other opinions from the community about balancing this stuff.
We have been using Richard Baker's facing and torpedo rules, but also these torpedo rules posted earlier by Fear God and Dreadnought!, with the addition that subs reload automatically every other turn (i.e. during the turn after they fire). The thing is, the lack of torpedo reloads hurts destroyers and other torpedo-focused ships, and combined with the evading torpedoes rule from Richard Baker's rules, might cause some balance issues.
To sum up, points to consider with torpedoes:
- Only one salvo can be launched from surface ships (excluding LLs). This is not as big an issue for subs since they can reload every other turn, but it really hurts/devalues destroyers and other torpedo-focused vessels.
- They can only be launched from the broadside (or the front with subs). This mostly only hinders subs, which are already hindered by the facing rules.
- Hitting on a 5 or a 6, or just a 6 if the target unit evades, seems too weak for torpedoes now that they only get one attack.
- There is ambiguity with what to do with torpedo attacks at range-0.
- Air-launched torpedoes must also be considered.
In vanilla, the main torpedo units, destroyers, are so fragile that they probably make an average of two torpedo attacks a game. My inclination is thus to buff torpedo attacks to hit on one die lower. Now one torpedo attack per game (hitting on a 5 or 6) will be roughly equal to the vanilla 2 per game (hitting on a 6).
Our solution was thus:
- We didn't want to screw up the already fragile balance planes, so air-launched torpedoes are unchanged from vanilla; they cannot be evaded and always hit on a 6. For simplicity, this rule is still applied to air units that can make range-1 attacks, such as the Jill.
- Surface ships may only launch one torpedo salvo per game (unless they have LLs, in which case they may withdraw and reload). Surface-launched torpedoes hit on a 4, 5, or 6 at range-1 or greater. This may be degraded to hitting on just a 5 or 6 if the targeted unit elects to evade the torpedoes instead of moving during the next movement phase. All surface-launched torpedoes which are launched at range-0 cannot be evaded, are resolved immediately during the surface attack step, and always hit on a 5 or 6. (This is because the extra power is already taken into account by the increased dice at range 0 that many ships have, and most units that are targeted by torpedoes at greater ranges seem to elect to evade anyway.)
- Submarines take 1 turn to reload their torpedoes, in the turn immediately after they fire them, with no penalties to their stats. Submarine-launched torpedoes also hit on a 4, 5, or 6 at range-1 or greater, and like surface ships, this may be degraded to hitting on just a 5 or 6 if the targeted unit elects to evade the torpedoes instead of moving during the next movement phase. (This is because although subs can reload quickly, they are hindered by their reduced movement with facing rules.) All submairne-launched torpedoes which are launched at range-0 cannot be evaded, are resolved immediately during the surface attack step, and always hit on a 5 or 6.
I felt that this might be the best way to balance things, though another member of my group expressed reservations that the 4/5/6 thing might make torpedoes too powerful now, despite the fact that attacks are finite. My question is, what do you guys think?
We have been using Richard Baker's facing and torpedo rules, but also these torpedo rules posted earlier by Fear God and Dreadnought!, with the addition that subs reload automatically every other turn (i.e. during the turn after they fire). The thing is, the lack of torpedo reloads hurts destroyers and other torpedo-focused ships, and combined with the evading torpedoes rule from Richard Baker's rules, might cause some balance issues.
To sum up, points to consider with torpedoes:
- Only one salvo can be launched from surface ships (excluding LLs). This is not as big an issue for subs since they can reload every other turn, but it really hurts/devalues destroyers and other torpedo-focused vessels.
- They can only be launched from the broadside (or the front with subs). This mostly only hinders subs, which are already hindered by the facing rules.
- Hitting on a 5 or a 6, or just a 6 if the target unit evades, seems too weak for torpedoes now that they only get one attack.
- There is ambiguity with what to do with torpedo attacks at range-0.
- Air-launched torpedoes must also be considered.
In vanilla, the main torpedo units, destroyers, are so fragile that they probably make an average of two torpedo attacks a game. My inclination is thus to buff torpedo attacks to hit on one die lower. Now one torpedo attack per game (hitting on a 5 or 6) will be roughly equal to the vanilla 2 per game (hitting on a 6).
Our solution was thus:
- We didn't want to screw up the already fragile balance planes, so air-launched torpedoes are unchanged from vanilla; they cannot be evaded and always hit on a 6. For simplicity, this rule is still applied to air units that can make range-1 attacks, such as the Jill.
- Surface ships may only launch one torpedo salvo per game (unless they have LLs, in which case they may withdraw and reload). Surface-launched torpedoes hit on a 4, 5, or 6 at range-1 or greater. This may be degraded to hitting on just a 5 or 6 if the targeted unit elects to evade the torpedoes instead of moving during the next movement phase. All surface-launched torpedoes which are launched at range-0 cannot be evaded, are resolved immediately during the surface attack step, and always hit on a 5 or 6. (This is because the extra power is already taken into account by the increased dice at range 0 that many ships have, and most units that are targeted by torpedoes at greater ranges seem to elect to evade anyway.)
- Submarines take 1 turn to reload their torpedoes, in the turn immediately after they fire them, with no penalties to their stats. Submarine-launched torpedoes also hit on a 4, 5, or 6 at range-1 or greater, and like surface ships, this may be degraded to hitting on just a 5 or 6 if the targeted unit elects to evade the torpedoes instead of moving during the next movement phase. (This is because although subs can reload quickly, they are hindered by their reduced movement with facing rules.) All submairne-launched torpedoes which are launched at range-0 cannot be evaded, are resolved immediately during the surface attack step, and always hit on a 5 or 6.
I felt that this might be the best way to balance things, though another member of my group expressed reservations that the 4/5/6 thing might make torpedoes too powerful now, despite the fact that attacks are finite. My question is, what do you guys think?