Can I see some examples of usn air power builds that you'd see in a tournament
Without getting into USN builds that would probably Handle those IJN builds. B-25’s against those DD swarms and Hellcats,Wildcats and Corsairs coming from 4 US Carriers to match those 4 IJN CVS Air wings I think stops it cold: If your using carrier for objective control how do you match Sara. and Lex.
I agree, but you wouldn't just build a fleet like that blindly. If you were working up a US air build the week before a tournament what would you bring
Without getting into USN builds that would probably Handle those IJN builds. B-25’s against those DD swarms and Hellcats,Wildcats and Corsairs coming from 4 US Carriers to match those 4 IJN CVS Air wings I think stops it cold: If your using carrier for objective control how do you match Sara. and Lex.
I agree, but you wouldn't just build a fleet like that blindly. If you were working up a US air build the week before a tournament what would you bring[/
If I’m going all air:: Sara: Lex: Yorktown: 6 Carrier Corsairs Offence -Defence — 3Avengers 2-11pt.— 1 14pt. Help with subs: Catalina Tough to stop swarms without knowing: This Would probably keep u in the game except against a IJN BB swarm
^^ THat is the argument at hand. That 1943 on, at 300 points USN can dominate with an air smash build that is insanely hard to stop. It absolutely can be beaten by good luck and a decent fleet build, but the luck requirement is very real. The team decks help a lot also, but it's just a bear to beat.
^^ THat is the argument at hand. That 1943 on, at 300 points USN can dominate with an air smash build that is insanely hard to stop. It absolutely can be beaten by good luck and a decent fleet build, but the luck requirement is very real. The team decks help a lot also, but it's just a bear to beat.
I would agree to that: The USN is tough as it was in the real war. The 200 pt. mark since I’ve been at the forum is the quintessential build for most play that’s balance, testing, tournament so on. So I personally like to compare at that range. The examples given in the opening of the thread: 200pt. IMO Can be easily handled by the USN: I guess that can be said about any build you have time to study. So I guess the question is does the USN have a KOD or not.
I would say no. At 200 points there's too many weaknesses to be plugged for an "invincible" build from the USN - regardless of the year.
Personally I find 1942 200 point games to be the great equalizer for just about every navy. The UK lags a bit in 1942 because some of its most versatile/effective units don't show till '43 which is unfortunate (Cuda, Firefly, Saumarez, Truculent) but it still can field lots of build archetypes and do very well with them.
Once you get above 100 points USN Air gets really tough to handle, but using Air Power DOES increase variance. It adds an extra layer of dice to the equation. At 300+ its really tough. I beat USN Air @ Gencon in the big 500 point game last year and I needed excellent AA dice the whole game and a vital on the Missouri to do it.
I've only been playing a couple years - so you all know better than me - but the way I've fought USN Air at 100 (not so tough to beat) and 200 is to just build a straight Anti-Air fleet. That's not the strength of IJN though. I've found it easier to make it work with KM and just create as many 8/9 AA rolls as you can. The abort rates are 64%/74% per die vs. 5 armor planes, which is pretty reasonable. However, this game is more often than not almost entirely dice dependent. Just my two cents.
Once you get above 100 points USN Air gets really tough to handle, but using Air Power DOES increase variance. It adds an extra layer of dice to the equation. At 300+ its really tough. I beat USN Air @ Gencon in the big 500 point game last year and I needed excellent AA dice the whole game and a vital on the Missouri to do it.
I've only been playing a couple years - so you all know better than me - but the way I've fought USN Air at 100 (not so tough to beat) and 200 is to just build a straight Anti-Air fleet. That's not the strength of IJN though. I've found it easier to make it work with KM and just create as many 8/9 AA rolls as you can. The abort rates are 64%/74% per die vs. 5 armor planes, which is pretty reasonable. However, this game is more often than not almost entirely dice dependent. Just my two cents.
If anything drew me to this game it was the die rolls:: The mechanics are simple, but theirs just enough in the play to keep you thinking.
Another factor in the USN air build is the excellent US AA on ships. Versus the IJN it is a "double-whammy" of less powerful aircraft and less powerful AA for the IJN. If I have the choice my Axis build of choice against the USN air build is also mostly Kriegsmarine. The "fantasy" AA values on the German ships give you half a chance. Not to mention using Kondors to try to whack a US carrier on the first turn. If you can pull that off you have a chance of beating the US build. But it still isn't easy with cheap Wildcats and San Diegos on defense.
The IJN Carrier Liberation Force - "Because We Care" Join the IJNCVLF. Service Guarantees Citizenship!
I don't play the USN "air cheese fleet" but I have had to fight against it many times.
This is one "typical" iteration. There are variations if you want to really emphasize torpedoes or bombers. Essex plus Lexington is also a popular combination. Against battleships the Avenger plus Catalina combo is deadly. The Avengers also give you defense against a sub build. One Hellcat is usually enough to use as a late placement "sniper." Cheap Warhawks (and Catalinas) help you maintain the important air placement advantage. Especially to protect your Catalinas. The Corsair is a powerful "swing" unit for offense or defense.
The idea is you don't bother to go for objectives. Your goal is to destroy the enemy fleet and get the surface bonus. Just make sure your opponent doesn't capture the third objective. If you still come up a little short then you can move the carriers up to an objective after your opponent is all but wiped out.